Tara - Irish UNESCO Tentative List due on April 15th!

by Pyrite Pirate Tue Apr 13, 2010 13:35

The plan is obvious, they will NOT submit Tara to the tentative list as there is no way in hell it could be accepted with the M3 running by the foot of the Hill and there is no way they will give up their precious Motorway. You can keep your fingers crossed all ya like for the 15th but dont hold your breath!

by M. Ni Bhrolchain Wed Apr 14, 2010 07:25

Irish Times, WHS nominations
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0414/1....html

World heritage status sought for sites

* CÉIDE FIELDS "Nowhere else is there such extensive physical remains of
a neolithic farmed landscape surviving," says the submission
CLONMACNOISE Included in a submission on early monastic sites GEORGIAN
DUBLIN Rebranded as "the historic city of Dublin" in the submission

FRANK McDONALD Environment Editor
WORLD HERITAGE SITES AND AREAS HOPING TO GET THE COVETED DESIGNATION:
The Historic City of Dublin
ROYAL TARA, Georgian Dublin, the Céide Fields in northwest Mayo, Dún
Aonghusa in Aran, the monastic site of Clonmacnoise and the Burren in Co
Clare are included on a “tentative list” of nominees to Unesco for
designation as world heritage sites.
Although Cashel, Killarney National Park and Clara Bog in Co Offaly were
submitted in 1992, none have yet been designated. Ireland still has only
three world heritage sites: Skellig Michael, off the Kerry coast; Brú na
Bóinne in Co Meath, and the Giant’s Causeway in Co Antrim. The latest
list of nominees again includes Cashel, but this time as one of “the
royal sites of Ireland” along with Dún Ailinne, Co Kildare; the Hill of
Uisneach, Co Westmeath; the Rathcroghan complex in Co Roscommon and the
Tara complex in Co Meath, which the M3 will pass by.
Though some had been affected by “erosion, agricultural and quarrying
activity”, they still had “all the elements necessary to express the
outstanding universal value of the royal sites” to give a “complete
representation of the features and processes conveying their significance”.
Georgian Dublin has been rebranded as “the historic city of Dublin” in
the submission to Unesco, made on behalf of Minister for the Environment
John Gormley. It is in not only because of its architecture, but also
for the city’s “extraordinary contribution to world literature”.
The submission also notes that Dublin’s Wide Streets Commissioners
became “Europe’s first official town planning authority” in 1757, with a
remit to make wide and convenient streets through congested parts of the
city “by the rational application of scientific and aesthetic principles”.
The Burren is described as “an excellent example of a landscape which
represents major stages of Earth’s history”, with fossil-rich karst
limestone beds still “actively evolving”, 6,000 years of human
settlement and a geological record that remains “highly visible and
accessible”. The Céide Fields are included as “the outstanding example
of human settlement, land-use and interaction with environment in
Neolithic times . . . Nowhere else is there such extensive physical
remains of a Neolithic farmed landscape surviving from this significant
period in prehistory”.
Dún Aonghusa is included among five western Stone Forts, the others
being Cahercommaun, Caherconree, Benagh and Staigue.
These represent “the apogee of the ring fort class of monument” that
“provides a mirror of the organisation, economy and polity of Irish
society” from AD 700 to AD 1000.
Much is also made of “the monastic city of Clonmacnoise and its cultural
landscape” by the Shannon. It is described in the submission as “an
unparalleled and outstanding example of a relict early medieval insular
monastic city unobscured by modern building development”.
Clonmacnoise is also included in a submission on early monastic sites
along with Durrow, Glendalough, Inis Cealtra, Kells and Monasterboice.
However, this is only the start of a process of getting them designated,
with the likely tourism opportunities such status would bring, as Mr
Gormley said.
The full list is to be presented to Unesco’s World Heritage Committee
meeting in Brasilia at the end of July.
The List

* The historic city of Dublin
* The Céide Fields and North West Mayo Boglands
* Western Stone Forts
* The Monastic City of Clonmacnoise and its cultural landscape
* Early Medieval Monastic Sites
* The Royal Sites of Ireland: Cashel, Dún Ailinne, Hill of Uisneach,
Rathcroghan Complex and Tara Complex

AWAITING DECISION SINCE 1992

* Killarney National Park, Cashel, Clara Bog

WORLD HERITAGE SITES IN IRELAND

* Skellig Michael, off the Kerry coast; Brú na Bóinne in Co Meath; and
the Giant’s Causeway in Co Antrim
////////////////////////////

Irish Independent
Magnificent seven battle for world heritage honour
The Rock of Cashel is among the Irish sites nominated for world heritage
listing with UNESCO.

By Paul Melia
Wednesday April 14 2010
IT'S our own magnificent seven. The Government has nominated seven sites
across Ireland, including the Burren in Co Clare and the "historic" city
of Dublin, to be added to the list of world heritage sites.
The Department of the Environment confirmed yesterday that the
nominations were sent to UNESCO last week to begin the process of adding
them to the list of areas deemed to be of "outstanding universal value".
Ireland already has three sites on the list -- the Giant's Causeway in
Co Antrim, which was inducted in 1986; Bru na Boinne (the Newgrange
complex) in Co Meath (1993); and Skellig Michael in Co Kerry (1996).
The latest nominated sites also include the Ceide Fields and North West
Mayo Boglands; Western Stone Forts; Monastic City of Clonmacnoise and
its Cultural Landscape; Early Medieval Monastic Sites; and the Royal
Sites of Ireland, which include Cashel, Dun Ailinne, Hill of Uisneach,
Rathcroghan and Tara.
World heritage sites are defined as being of "cultural and/or natural
significance which is so exceptional as to transcend national boundaries
and to be of common importance for present and future generations of all
humanity", according to UNESCO.
There are 900 properties on the list, including the Alhambra in Spain,
Red Square in Russia and Acropolis in Greece.
Literary
Management plans for the sites have to be completed before UNESCO will
consider adding them to the list, a process which could take 18 months,
a spokesman for Environment Minister John Gormley said.
"This list has been the result of extensive consultation," he said. "We
have some very interesting and innovative sites including literary and
Georgian Dublin, which amalgamates two of the key elements which make
our capital so special, but a lot more work needs to be carried out at
these sites."
In its submission on Dublin, the Government says it was the most
important city, after London, of the British Empire in the Georgian
period (1714-1830), much of which survives today. And three of Ireland's
four Nobel laureates for literature -- WB Yeats (1923), George Bernard
Shaw (1925) and Samuel Beckett (1969) -- were from Dublin.
The Burren is an "outstanding example" of the use of a very challenging
environment over 6,000 years, while the Ceide Fields in Mayo are the
"most extensive Stone Age monument in the world".
Clonmacnoise is heralded as an "unparalleled example of an early
medieval insular monastic city", while six early medieval sites,
including Glendalough and Kells, are described as being principal
examples of "centres of Celtic learning, teaching and enlightenment".
The Royal Sites of Ireland, which includes the Hill of Tara, has also
been added to the list. The Western Stone Forts -- seven on Aran,
including Dun Aonghusa, and others in Clare and Kerry -- are also
nominated.

by Pyrite Pirate Wed Apr 14, 2010 14:05

So, they can be seen to be doing the right thing finally but Tara still wont be accepted as it will never meet the criteria. Gombeens.

by Geologist. Wed Apr 14, 2010 15:26

The only thing interesting about "Georgian Buildings" are the doors.

The rest of them are just an uninteresting wall of red bricks.

Georgian Dublin in no way ever compared to Vienna,or Paris, or Prague, or St. Petersbourg.
(To name just a very few truly beautiful European cities.)

As for the Burren being a "World Heritage Site" ?

There are thousands of such "Karst" geological formations around the world.
Ask any "caver".

The Burren isn't even particularly spectacular by Irish standards.

The Billion year old Pre-Cambrian mountains of Connemara are much more awe inspiring and spectacular.

And geologically fantastically older and more interesting than the Burren.
.

by Dub. Wed Apr 14, 2010 16:02

We Dubs never look at the Georgian bricks Geologist.

We just look at the lovely doors of Dublin:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/johnofdublin/2464365519/
.

by Tara Tara Tara Fri Apr 16, 2010 11:42

The Collierstown Cairn erected last year by Tara defenders as a memorial to those who were at peace there for thousands of years until the desectration brought by the M3 Motorway, has been taken down today. The area is being landscaped and levelled. However, we will erect it again and again until a proper memorial is put in place to mark this spot as a place of importance. Some repute this to be the burial place of the Fianna after their famous last stand at the Battle of Gabhra. Other sources from mythology and history claim that this is the burial place of the Queens of Tara.

During excavations up to 92 bodies were removed from their sacred burial place and are now being stored in an unknown location.

Shame!

Collierstown Cairn

by Tara Tara Tara Fri Apr 16, 2010 13:28

It may still be possible that Tara will be included as a World Heritage Site but a lot of that rests with Meath Co Co and what way they will vote on area development plans on 5th July. Currently there is a scheme involving them, the Dept of Environment and the Heritage Council known as the Tara Skryne Landscape Project and submissions have been invited on conservation, heritage protection etc You will find details on their website. Yes the horse has already bolted but it's all we have to work with pending a re route- which will probably never happen, unfortunately.

by Tara Tara Tara Fri Apr 16, 2010 13:32

If you are interested in the pyrite issue please read the Transcript of Joint Oireachtas Committee for Transport Meeting 7th A pril 2010 at the link below. Its scandalous and riveting reading!

www.savetara.com

by Tara Tara Tara Fri Apr 16, 2010 13:42

Another interesting read for your information is this letter which appeared on www.savetara.com today:

Hi,

I presume X asked you to send the info on Coillte to me ? which is fine, it is very clear from my own examination of the road and how it was bent to hit Rath Lugh at the time, that it was being done to facilitate including Coillte in the CPO process and basically giving public money to a corrupt semi-states coffers whose only profits were coming from the sale of the public forest estate in their care. Coillte in effect were the largest land developer in the country disguised as a forestry company during the celtic tiger years. Coillte made over 300 million euros profits over twenty years,( this money is gone..?) and now with the property market collapse are operating a 120 million deficit and have been proposed for privatisation.

I was thinking about that CPO last year when I was attending a Environmental law conference that had a barrister giving a presentation on CPOs. During the coffee break I asked him a hypothetical question regarding whether the State can use CPO legislation to obtain land when the land in question is effectively already owned by the State, ( as in the Rath Lugh case ). He replied that the State could not use CPO law on itself as it would not make sense and proceeded to exit stage left without a word, he just nervously moved away. I never mentioned any details as my query was purposefully vague.

Coillte have been claiming to be a private company for years yet in 2003 the European Court of Justice found them to be a wholly owned Public body in a dispute over Coillte claiming EU grants that were meant to go to hill farmers for tree planting. Coillte have carried on ignoring the ECJ case in Ireland and behaving as a private entity without challenge.

We have a copy of the court case if you want the details, but it is clear thay are a Public body, therefore there is a genuine possibility that the CPO act does not apply to them and the law was broken, a National Monument desecrated, your case distorted in terms of the legal description of Coillte before the Court.

The protestors it would seem had more rights to be on Rath Lugh defending its status than the confused rogue entity Coillte. You had the rights to claim protection under the constitution as living Irish citizens, Coillte on the other hand is not recognised by the constitution. It might be worth asking a helpful barrister to examine the CPO legislation in regard to Coillte to determine if in fact the act can apply to them , my feeling is that the act was created to obtain Private land for infrastructure purposes in the national interest and was never intended to be used for Public/State lands, after all why would the State need to buy land from itself.

Regards,

Rath Lugh which still remains fenced in and closed to the public. Photo Joanne Corbett

by TaraTaraTara Fri Apr 16, 2010 13:49

as it is today. The protesters have all gone but the public still cannot use this ammenity. It is a National Monument which should be open to all.

Dont Fence Me In

by Tara Tara Tara Fri Apr 16, 2010 13:56

Bertie and Coillte.

Bertie gets it on the streets of Dublin :)

by Just Stood There. Fri Apr 16, 2010 16:50

The motorway cannot even be seen from The Hill of Tara.

Unlike a seeming zillion other roads which have "desecrated" the site over the millemia.
.

by Morrigan Sat Apr 17, 2010 18:34

When was the last time you JUST STOOD THERE? The motorway is Very visible from the Hill which just shows you havnt a clue what you are talking about.

by TaraTaraTara Sun Apr 18, 2010 11:10

It is not only visible but it is also far more audible than the old N3 ever was. This photo was taken in the field below where the Vigil Camp used to be, at the far end of the Banqueting Hall. Unfortunately I dont have a good zoom on my camera to pick out the road but you cant miss it with the naked eye. I think it is the traffic noise that will gain your attention first though. The motorway can also be seen standing at the Forradh.

by Setanta. Sun Apr 18, 2010 17:39

Why don't you object to the modern industrial complex easily visible between your camera and the new road?
(The pic was taken from the extreme edge of the site.)

You seem to object only to bits of modernity which you don't like.

The whole site is destroyed by electricity and telephone wires.

Not to mention tarmacadum roads going in all directions.

Why don't you object to them?

P.S:
Nobody has the slightest notion as to where they used to banquet at Tara.
.

.

by TaraTaraTara Mon Apr 19, 2010 08:46

Banqueting Hall

Petrie Map

by TaraTaraTara Mon Apr 19, 2010 08:53

Tech Midchúarta

Petrie Map

by Wanderer Mon Apr 19, 2010 10:15

I've come across a few bits and pieces on the Internet which cast some additional light on Teach Míchuarta (The Great Banqueting Hall on the Hill of Tara), and which may be of interest to other viewers who are at present unaware of them.

For example, there is the piece below from 'The Legend of Tara' by Elizabeth Hickey (Dundalgan Press, Ltd. 1996):

"Some (of the stories of Tara) must have been recited in that very banqueting hall we can trace to-day. They have been told and re-told through the centuries in the duns and raths and houses and cottages of the people of Ireland. Myths and Legends and historical Sagas are intermingled and it is profitless for any but the specialist to ask how much is truth and how much legend: the interest for us lies in the fact that these tales reflect a civilization and an outlook of which we are the ultimate heirs. Much, indeed, is true enough." (This excerpt has come from http://www.festivaloftara.org/tarahistory/TaraTextPage2....html )

There is also the following piece from http://www.libraryireland.com/SocialHistoryAncientIrela...7.php :

"The whole site of the Hall was occupied by a great timber building, 45 feet high or more, ornamented, carved, and painted in colours. Within this the Feis or Convention of Tara held its meetings, which will be found described in chap. xxv., sect. 1, farther on. Here also were held the banquets from which the Hall was named Tech Midchuarta [Meecoorta], the 'mead-circling house'; and there was an elaborate subdivision of the inner space, with the compartments railed or partitioned off, to accommodate the guests according to rank and dignity. For, as will be seen in next chapter, they were very particular in seating the great company in the exact order of dignity and priority. From this Hall, moreover, the banqueting-halls of other great houses commonly received the name of Tech Midchuarta."

Fascinating stuff?

by Setanta. Mon Apr 19, 2010 11:41

We all love Tara.

Dont make things up because a motorway is visible in the far distance.

by Setanta. Mon Apr 19, 2010 11:52

"Teach Míchuarta (The Great Banqueting Hall on the Hill of Tara),"

Ah. .

That must be the motorway.
.

by Tara Tara Tara Mon Apr 19, 2010 15:53

Setanta I dont know what your problem is, unless its just any old argument you are looking for. The Banqueting Hall was the ceremonial entrance to Tara and I posted the map above so that all could see where the photo was taken from- between Tobar Finn and Treduma Ness to be exact but I thought my previous directions were sufficient for most people.

by Wanderer Mon Apr 19, 2010 18:26

"The Banqueting Hall was the ceremonial entrance to Tara."

Does this mean that the Banqueting Hall had a dual function?

In other words, was it both a Banqueting Hall and a ceremonial entrance?

I ask this question because a number of reports I've come across on the Internet seem to suggest that this site, the only one on the Hill of Tara which is rectangular in shape, was merely a ceremonial entrance.

Any additional information anybody might have relating to this point would be much appreciated.

by Cormac the wise Tue Apr 20, 2010 09:25

Hey there Setanta, your brain must have been damaged when your head left your body and got buried on Tara. Look at the photos - that white shiny thing snaking along the Valley is the M3 - and the brown thing behind it is Rath Lugh with the esker covered with a crib wall. This photo was taken from outside the coffee shop, the view from the top of the Hill of the road is better.
You can't object to existing building child, so that's irrelevant, neither little roads nor wires but then you always were a wayward child.
Hey, don't you know, it wasn't the view that was the protesters' problem? It was the Valley - idiot.
And btw - no one banqueted there – it’s a burial/ritual/inauguration site not a party venue.
The 'banqueting hall' is only a medieval name for a pre-historic 'cursus' - the entrance to Tara but then i guess your distortions popped your common sense - i doubt you could make sense or learn from this.
Your daddy, the God Lugh (my fort btw - wow! Isn't modern technology wonderful!)

Shiny white M3 with crib-walled Rath Lugh

by Alice. Wed Apr 21, 2010 19:40

The ugliest things in that photo are the big modern electricity poles.

You can hardly see the new road.
.

by Setanta. Wed Apr 21, 2010 19:49

The new road is not the one in the foreground.

It is the white bits you strain to make out in the background.
.

by TaraTaraTara Thu Apr 22, 2010 09:13

Hi Alice,

I have provided a link below to a pressure group you may be interested in.

And Setanta, thats not a road in the foreground its a wall, then a field boundary. When was the last time you "Just Stood There"? You are obviously in favour of the €1 bn Motorway having destroyed the sacred heritage of this once proud valley. We have nothing in common. You however are entitled to your opinion and if you can rest easy thats all that matters.

Teamhair Abú

by Setanta. Thu Apr 22, 2010 09:46

The archaeologists in the Office of Public Works approved the motorway.

Indeed a team of archaeologists precede the motorway.

Lots found....which would never have been found.

Nothing lost..not even the view.
.

by Setanta. Thu Apr 22, 2010 09:57

"And Setanta, thats not a road in the foreground its a wall, then a field boundary."

Why dont you copy and paste the photo and ZOOM IN on it TaraTaraTara.

It IS a modern road.

by Architect Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:45

The motorway was designed not to offend the landscape.

Invisibility is built in.

Once the motorway is completed and landscaped the only road you will see in a new photo from that spot will be the foreground road you see passing in front of the two foreground trees.

by TaraTaraTara Thu Apr 22, 2010 15:32

Well thats alright then, the M3 is such a huge blessing betcha cant wait to pay for it twice.

Kinda reminds of a meeting I attended recently where a pro road man who lives at Garlow Cross told us how he welcomed the M3 but in my mind I couldnt help thinking " Wonder how welcoming you will be when the Outer Orbital comes up your posterior. There wont be many in Garlow/Skryne happy then".

The noise levels at the moment are shocking enough and can be heard clearly on the Hill of Tara and that is even before the rest of the 6 lane interchange comes into action! It will funnell up the valley travelling along the waters of the Gabhra, perhaps to your front door.

by Robur Sat Apr 24, 2010 08:30

The M3 is a wonderful piece of modern road engineering and I for one will look forward in being able to become a frequent user. Suffice to say that the double road tolls will help to keep it free from the old bangers and begrudgers.

Finally we shall see childish protesters who have bedevilled the evirons of Sacred Tara, with their clamour remove themselves. For they be nothing but a plague on the landscape of modern Ireland.

by Plonker Exterminator Sat Apr 24, 2010 14:09

Robur wrote:

"Suffice to say that the double road tolls will help to keep it free from the old bangers and begrudgers."

While the above is ridiculousness enough, What is your come back to the fact that if projected income from the tolls is not met, then the Irish taxpayers already heavily overburdened as it is, will have to make up the difference ? Go on I'm dying to hear it.

by Muireann Ní Bhrolcháin Sat Apr 24, 2010 20:19

The double-tolled road will keep commuters in general off the road and follow Noel Dempsey's advice - take the old road. Then we'll be paying the toll company for the shortfall in tolls. Not the people of Meath but all of us, as if taxes/levies etc were not bad enough.
Good luck with the road Robur, and the tolls that will increase exponentially over the years. Traffic figures continue to decrease on the N3 - Meath has one of the highest unemployment figures in Ireland.
The M3 will be a monument - a monument to the stupidity, greed and hubris of the Celtic Tiger years - Noel Dempsey's vanity project.

by Finn McCool. Mon Apr 26, 2010 16:41

The M3 will be a monument - a monument to the stupidity, greed and hubris of the Celtic Tiger years.

Just like the original monument.

by Carmel Diviney - Tara Skryne Preservation Group Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:04

Hi all,

The Tara Skryne Preservation Group are pleased to announce our new website has gone live in time for Bealtainne and the May Bank Holiday weekend. We hope you enjoy making your way through the articles, videos, slideshows, poetry, photos etc. Our submissions to both UNESCO and the Tara Skryne Landscape Project are included.

We would like to thank our Webmistress sincerely for the long hours she put into constructing the site and to all who contributed in any way. It is a great testament to the Tara people that after all the desecration and destruction, so much positive energy still exists to keep moving forward come what may.

On a personal note, I would like to thank all the TSPG ers especially all those who never missed a meeting. I would like to thank Sean Gilmartin, Heather Buchannon, and Joanne Corbett in particular for all their hard work on the TSLP submission and without whom it would never have made it to draft stage.

Best wishes,

Carmel Diviney,
Secretary TSPG.

by Tara Tara Tara Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:56

I hear that private Security are being employed to police the Hill of Tara over the Bank Holiday weekend and are being drafted in from 4pm today- the heavies. Waste of money- all the protesters are going to Rath Croghan and Uisneach :)

by Fionn Fri Apr 30, 2010 13:35

And the Hill of Allen

by Security Guard. Sun May 02, 2010 12:37

The makers of Tara had to have their own private security.

That is why they built a Fortress on the high ground of Tara.

Designed to defend.

Tara exemplisives insecurity and nervousness about the neighbours.

We Security Guards were always needed.
.

.

by Tara Tara Tara Tue May 04, 2010 16:07

No word back from the pro roaders since they were asked about the tolls, the trolls.

Heard there was only security at the Hill on Saturday but I bet they were on standby. Heard also that Dempsey's brother went for a spin in a truck across the Hill with Security on lookout. Anyone got any pictures?

by Evil Roadbuilder. Tue May 04, 2010 19:58

The road won't be seen from Tara when it is built.

The protesters can't even see the local roads in their own photos.
,

by Tara Tara Tara Wed May 05, 2010 11:53

I have been getting reports from locals that they were afraid to go up the Hill with all the hi -vis jackets to get past on Saturday. This is intimidation and it is completely unnecessary. They are spoiling what should be a peaceful and enjoyable experience of the Hill itself, it is completely over the top.

People have been camping there for years especially on special occasions and move off leaving the place undisturbed and without this level of acrimony. Three people arrived with tents, one a foreigner and were turned away. Dont use the Protesters as an excuse- they have all moved off and have had their own camp on private land nearby for the last two years so why keep intimidating visitors like this ? Cant be good for business at the Coffee Shop either! What do the bus loads of Tourists think?

Is this what we are to expect at every celebration of the season? Same again for Summer Solstice, just getting us used to the long term plan are they?

by Evil Road Builder. Wed May 05, 2010 19:01

Don't worry Tara Tara Tara.

When the road is finished you will hardly know that it exists.