Des Dalton: Republicans must deliver a clear and coherent message

by Cael - Sinn Féin Poblachtach Fri Aug 15, 2008 16:00

Kevin, a chara, I said that 5% own 40% of all wealth in the 26 counties, less then 1% own 50% of the land, including 100% of zoned building land. These figures do not include the 2003 billion euro (CSO figures, Dec 31, 2006) invested by Irish residents abroad.

by Kevin t. Walsh - Republicanism and Unity Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:49

I am intrigued again at JJ O'Kelly's reply to Des Dalton re. the commeration for Mr. Goss. Des Dalton as usual gives a good framework towards an Irish Republic verbally and I agree with some of the article. But lets put it in another psyche.

1. If we had full unity within the Republican movement, under a new leadership now, who would map out the road to Demascus or the road to Irish Freedom without shedding blood or the loss of one life.

Ireland was always and will be full of historians from the armchair and of course, the pedestals at commerations all over the country. Mr. O'Kelly wrote about Unity for the ordinary people of Ireland and trade unions for better conditions and pay. I ask Des Dalton now, and his followers to show their passion for Ireland - and I know they have in some small part but to me it is not enough.

Do I really have to remind you that we have a health system in a shambles: according to Cael 5% own the wealth of Ireland - this is not factual. Ed Moloney has a fair minded approach to Irish Republicanism. Moloney has written books on the IRA for many years now and last week, Anthony MacIntyre, a former top Republican in Belfast gave him a view of his forthcoming book 'The Death of Irish Republicanism'. In one of his lines he ascertains 'Is the IRA Army Council still in existence?' The question is intriguing because it speaks for itself that McGuinness was right in saying in Derry at a speech 'that the IRA had gone away'.

A few years ago, the two governments wouldn't have needed to ponder these things if the (IRA are gone away or not). A steady stream of bombings, shootings and attacks on the British personnel would have reminded them that the IRA were still intact. That went on for 30 years and now it is over.

MacIntyre may not be popular in certain republican circles but you must give the man credit, he spent 18 years in prison for being a Provo and completed his PHD in Republican History. MacIntyre goes on further by claiming the IRA and the army council are on its death bed and soon will be gone forever. Peter Sheridan, deputy Chief Constable, PSNI - in the Times last week stated 'Through MI5 intelligence and Police intelligence that the Army Council seldom meet now and that the threat of old is long gone'. As Martin McGuinness put it in his own words - the IRA are off the stage since 2005 but attempts are made by some people, to drag them back on stage, but as Guinness said, 'this is rather silly. Sinn Fein is currently marketing a tee shirt with a rising Phoenix symbolising the IRA and the slogan 1968 to 2008 The Struggle Continues. The message is inescapable give or take a few months. The tee shirt marks the life span of the Provisional IRA.

Sinn Fein right not in many circles have lost the path. Their election showings last year was a shambles and the party must re-ignite new members, acknowledge feedback from emails and letters and Listen to the people. The big question for Adams is and will be for a long time yet - in 2007, coming from 5 seats in the Dail, coming from 12, he is back to 4 seats in the Dail (Crow lost his seat). Yet nobody seems to have the courage to take Adams or the leadership of Sinn Fein on.

In 1925, the Boundary Commission findings are leaked by the Morning Post. The two Governments agreed to retain the existing Ulster Free State border - the Unionists gain almost total control of the NI Parliament and most important of all - the IRA breaks with Eamon De Valera and forms and independent army council and the famous Irish writer, Liam O'Flaherty publishes his famous book, The Informer. I ask Mr. O'Kelly and Mr. Dalton, what really has changed since 1925 - can they answer me? Perople want Peace. People have goty Peace. I applaud the Eamon Ceannt commemoration in Crumlin next week. I applaud the hunger strikers of the 1981.

My last question is a little more serious for Des Dalton - I would like his opinion on what those 10 men really died for. We know how it started with Kieran Nugent and sadly we know how he died and Darkie Hughes in West Belfast, also. Irish history was always complex because there was always the hidden agenda of who was right and who was wrong? There is a young generation in Ireland now - they are good young people, they travel the world, they work for voluntary organisations like Amnesty and Concern - I applaud these young people and I hope they never have to hold a gun in their hand for any Cause.

Irish mothers have lost two many sons - for what? They so, often have to ask themselves?

(What I have written here is totally factual, from research, my books and my files)

Kevin

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Wed Aug 13, 2008 18:42

Indymedia article by Kevin Walsh.

Title: 'Those who forget history are condemned to repeat it' George Santayana, South America

The question now is whose history, who has the perspective?

Is the history not made on the day by effectiveness?

Qualification No1

Repetitive learning is part of our approach to education in Ireland, mainly through generations of clerical influence from Rome. Thankfully, there may be a change afoot to the more creative kind with ideas creating more ideas and people willing to learn rather than to judge on rigid doctrine of facts.

Qualification No 2.

Quotation that keeps the l'esprit de corp in me:
Gandhi Pacifist
'Live as if you are going to die tomorrow but learn as if you are going to learn for the rest of your life'.......as a person with acquired , not unlike former Taoiseach Albert Reynolds who is no longer able to attend the Mahon Tribunal due to a professional diagnosis by 4 specialists of Mild Cognitive Impairment.......what happens here? He may not supply the facts criteria in court......but this does not in anyway mean he will no longer have a view about History, and rightly so.

Des - Your Oration. (a contrast is to be found in the article mentioned above).

Evidently you accept the Republicans are now firmly factioned, by choice. You speak of Moral Truth and the righteousness of a cause which people give up their lives.

You ask: 'Have men died in vain? No they have not but what about the men who are part of a more sinister hidden history, the men, women and children, who gave up their blood for the Cause and those who are stoic enough to endorse change and who dedicated their time, to learn in such a way as if they were going to die tomorrow. Mo Mowlam is just one who was such a inspiration.

Let us contextualise 1940.......Ireland was a young partition State, a self selected Neutral State, with implications through the Church mainly of connections with Germany. Fianna Fail, constantly aware of usurpers, were caught between WW2 and Churchill, their nearly ex. Colonial power. Strategic risks abounded and no doubt fear prompted a path of internment.

Des. This is where I have issue. The Firing Squad and The Gallows. This has been significantly played down, Hunger Strike is an awful death. You say that their sacrifice endorsed the Republican Ideal?

You mention, Richard Goss and how he epitomised that generation. No doubt, he did. Austin Clarke, the poet, refers to these men as the Last Republicans 1936-1940 - the inspired generation by the succeeding generation. Men in the theme of the Irish Republican Brotherhood. He joined the North louth Battalion of the IRA in 1933....De Valera came to power and Fianna Fail 1932..some mixed messages here for the newly partitioned Ireland. Like now, for membership of the IRA, he received a sentence of 3 months imprisonment y the Free State Military Court.
There were a lot of internees then, creeping up year by year.

Des, this is the point that really needs clarification -

Goss, an OTR, was appointed OC North Leinster - South Ulster Division of the IRA.....it was a campaign against British Forces in the six counties. Goss was finally captured. He was tried by the infamous 'Military Court' which was comprised of 3 Irish Free State who had no legal training. Regardless of the charge, anyone was convicted by this had a mandatory death sentence imposed. This was carried out within 48 hours by firing squad. Apparently, no appeal was allowed to any court - the 26 County administration could commute sentence or confirm it.

The Dail courts existed. What about the precedent? I know my Grandfather defended Erskine Childers, and it is written and I have heard, that Michael Comyn KC was most distress when his client and friend Erskine Childers was shot while on appeal.

Des - can you explain how Goss was tried executed in the Irish Free State, having been tried by 3 men without legal experience by the Irish Free State.

The Charge of membership surely would not have caused a court martial.

Perhaps, it is more in line with Treason, given our stance of Neutrality and De Valera's standoff with Churchill.

I don't know but for a new State that decision to intern and execute by Court Martial without appeal. I suggest reading the related link. As the posting by Flynn says 'History begins with China'

The book is written about Dail Courts in Ireland by David Foxton, QC......and it is worth readings.

The lives of 40 men were saved in the Clifford O'Sullivan case.......what about views of the successors of these men....what do they think about war and peace.

The Book just published
Revolutionary Lawyers
Sinn Fein and Crown Courts
in Ireland and Britain
1916-1923

Look to the reply from Mr. Clifford in New Zealand.....

by Sceptic Wed Aug 13, 2008 15:33

The 1916 Proclamation is not a statement of principles. It is a skewed historical narrative linking highly disparate uprisings over centuries to the 1916 effort. Essentially this document ignores or repudiates anyone who does not share the minority mindset of the authors. Brave men they might have been but they did not have the right to invoke the Irish nation for themselves or to claim fidelity from the people to their conception of the Republic or to put others besides themselves in mortal danger. Most of all unionism is effectively ignored as is the non-violent and majority parliamentary tradition. Even since the end of the civil war thousands of people, many of them completely innocent, have been consigned to early graves because of 1916 literalists who refuse to take on board any lessons or experience gained since the proclamation was written. This is a basic problem with irredentist republicanism. It is elitist, anti democratic and morally blind. In the hands of it’s more zealous adherents the Proclamation is a fascistic license to kill or maim the Irish or any other people who don’t get with their programme or stand in their way in some manner.

Thsi brand of Republicanism is in a historical cul de sac because like the Bourbons they learn nothing and forget nothing.

by jj o'kelly Tue Aug 12, 2008 17:55

this is the articulation of common sense. the republican movement is republican unity.

Meanwhile we hear calls for unity from many disparate elements; Irish Republicans are described as ‘elitist’ and ‘backward’ if they are not willing to dilute their programme in the interest of this so-called ‘unity’.

“Irish Republicans want unity. In 1969/70 and in 1986 Republicans resisted those who sought to divert the Republican Movement down the cul de sac of reformism. Many of those most vociferous now in their calls for ‘unity’ ignored the leadership given by Republicans such as Ruairí Ó Brádaigh and Daithí Ó Conaill who charted a path of unity based on the sure foundations of basic Republican principle.

“It is true unity that is required to achieve the goal of Irish freedom. But it must be a real unity based on a common programme, cohesive and coordinated and based on unequivocal Republicanism.

“The Republican Movement provides such a programme, it is the only vehicle which can deliver direction and leadership it has and remains in the words of Dáithí Ó Conaill the “catalyst for the most progressive forces in this country”. Irish Republicans have always given the lead, most obviously in leading the struggle against British rule, but also in defending and promoting the Irish language, the rights of workers, in support of Irish neutrality and opposing imperialist wars particularly the use of Irish airports and airspace in support of them. Since 1972 Republican Sinn Féin and the Republican Movement have opposed the creation of a militarised and undemocratic EU superstate and played its part in the recent defeat of the Lisbon Treaty.

“The editorial of The United Irishman in December 1957 pointed the way forward: “The Republican Movement takes its stand on the Proclamation of 1916, and any instrument or enactments which in any way curtail that charter of liberty can have no validity for Irish Republicans.

“By strict adherence to principles, by pursuing a clearly-defined policy, by placing the national interest before personal considerations, the Irish Republican Movement has built up a reputation for honesty and integrity. The Irish people can put their trust in that Movement sure in the knowledge that it will never betray them or their interests.”

“The lessons are simple; by sticking to the basic fundamentals of Irish Republicanism is the only means to ensure unity of purpose whilst delivering a clear and coherent message to the Irish people. At the Ard Fheis of Republican Sinn Féin in 1983 Ruáiri Ó Brádaigh pointed to the fact that there were no splits or splintering of the Republican Movement during the period 1969/70 to 1983, “Long may it remain so” he said, “as it will provided we stick to basic principles”.

“Drawing our inspiration from the memory of Richard Goss and his comrades let us set about building a mass movement of the Irish people capable of delivering a 32-County Democratic Socialist Republic.”