Ireland's Imperial Adventure in Chad

by prolatarian Wed Mar 26, 2008 14:41

Ocupation of chad by irish soldiers,Irish soldiers refusing to serve in chad.You dont know many DF members do you?

They are going as peace keapers.hundreds of thousands of people are in refugee camps under constant thret of disease,starvation,de-hydration and attack by rebbles and some of you would sooner see the irish gov do nothing to help them.you would sooner see them at the mercy of the rebbles.

The irish gov has no interest in 'propping' up derby's goverement
we all know the kind of murdering criminall he is but that's the way it is.you hardly think the rebbles are any better.But that dosent mean the refugees should be abandond to their fate.Nither dose the fact that the rebbles said they would attack the peace keapers.
The irish soldiers are more than capabel or defending themselves. They know the dangers involved in what they do, Its their job

They will do their duty with the dedication bravery and profesionalism that we have rightly come to ekpect of them and for that we should be truly proud.

by none Wed Mar 26, 2008 01:18

watch the clip http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0316/9news_av.html?2349786,...l,230') couldn't find an easy way to screen grab realplayer.

by Padraig Wed Mar 12, 2008 09:31

"Irish troops should be in Ireland sorting out the mess here..."

But you see yourself that when a corrupt elite is kicked out the freedom fighters take over their offices and quickly adopt the same behaviour as the people they kicked out and things go on as before.

If British power is ended in Ireland it will merely lead to Irish elites taking their place, feathering their own nest, looking after their pals and shutting the door in the face of the opposition.

To operate a political party in Ireland requires donations and the support of vested interests.
No matter how pure intentions maybe they are always compromised by political expediency.

One part of the battle is getting power and the second part of keeping it - aspirations and promised changes go out the window.
By the time most governments lose power they have exhausted goodwill and exist in power merely for the sake of power.

by Roger Cole - Peace & Neutrality Alliance Tue Mar 11, 2008 19:19 pana at eircom dot net

The Ahern Government amended the law to ensure Irish soldiers have to serve abroad when they also diluted the "triple lock" legislation.
As far as " Irish Neutrality" is concerned, it was only a policy of government. This policy was terminated when in total contravention of International law on neutrality as stated in the Hague Convention of 1907 the Ahern Government turned Ireland intoa US aircraft carrier and allowed planes known to carry prisoners to torture chambers to land at Shannon Airport and possibly other airports without being searched. Ireland is now not neutral. It is an integral part of the US/EU/NATO military machine in order to ensure Ireland's active participation in the resource wars of the 21st century.
The decision by the Ahern Government to sendd troops to Chad can only be understood in that context. Anybody with even a shred of knowledge of the tradition of French Imperialist that thinks they care about refugees are living in a fantasy world. The Ahern Government and the rest of the Irish political elite do not live in a fantasy world whatever about some contributors to this debate. Like Redmond, they genuinely believe that the Irish people should participate in Imperialist wars and they have the support of virtualy the entire corporate media just as Redmond did in 1914.
However as Ireland gets dragged deeper and deeper into these resource wars, the Chad adventure being just one, it will put a greater strain on the EU/US/NATO resources (the war in Iraq has cost the US, $3 trillion. President Bush, who Ahern has described as a, " Great President" is leading his country into recession. The defeat of Bush, Ahern and the other Imperialists is only a matter of time, unfortunately more time than than one would like. However since over 180,000 volunteered to fight for British Imperialism in 1914-18, I doubt if Ahern and the others will convince the same number to die for the emerging EU Superstate. Campaigning for a NO vote to the Renamed EU Constitution (the Lisbon Treaty) is the best way to fight the Irish Imperialists.
For now Indymedia provides virtually the only media outlet for those of us who are opposed to the restoration of the Irish Imperialist tradition.

by Ronoc Tue Mar 11, 2008 15:31

"the occupation of Chad or Sudan by imperialist troops might give breathing space for Sudan and Chad to become peaceful then prosperous and then seek independence once again on a sounder footing - when they launch a peaceful or violent revolution against the French and Irish occupiers as they inevitably will they will have a stable society to fall back on once they kick the Europeans out again."

As you say above, if this where to happen, the first thing to happen would be that the corporations would be straight in to exploit the country by taking all its resourses and selling them to the highest bidder. Where would these comes from?? I let you figure that one. Who would this benefit? The fat cat executives and shareholders, but on the up side some people would have jobs where they get paid feck all while these companies are bursting their seems with profits.

"When the power of love, overcomes the love of power, the world will know PEACE"

Irish troops should be in Ireland sorting out the mess here...

by donkylemore Tue Mar 11, 2008 13:58

FIGHTING FOR PEACE IS LIKE FUCKING FOR CHASTITY...anon
Seen on a lavatory wall sometime in the 60's

by Padraig Tue Mar 11, 2008 12:23

But if as a by product of window dressing the people of Chad and Sudan are not slaughtered by janjaweed or rebels then who cares what the French and Irish do?

The occupation of Chad or Sudan by imperialist troops might give breathing space for Sudan and Chad to become peaceful then prosperous and then seek independence once again on a sounder footing - when they launch a peaceful or violent revolution against the French and Irish occupiers as they inevitably will they will have a stable society to fall back on once they kick the Europeans out again.

It shouldn't be a case "Of what have the Romans ever done for us?"

The French and Irish might civilise the place and then civilised Sudanese and Chadians can tell them we can take care of our own affairs now so fuck Au Revoir Pierre agus Slan abhaile Sean.

by donkylemore Tue Mar 11, 2008 00:39

Of all the Eu countries , we have least interest in engaging in a EU military mission in a post colonial situation. ; The French have colonial interests in Chad ; the Chinese have more immediate economic interests in Sudan , with their ever increasing thirst for oil . We have no colonial interest anywhere. We just emerged from British colonialism , and some would argue - not quite completely To be seen now to prop a post colonial regimen by sending in Irish troops is a gross error. We have served with distinction from the Congo to the Lebanon , East Timor Namibia , Liberia etc.
To think that the rebels will distinguish between a EU for force and a French force is naive . It is as much an absurdity to reason that they will either look at the colour and texture of the uniform or the flag , than to expect our blue eyes to inure our troops from enemy fire ; They have declared that they will treat our troops as enemies - there is no ambiguity on the rebel's behalf.
Moreover , and more hideously while the French general in charge of f 'Indigenous ' French troops will be based in Chad , the Irish general in charge of the EUfor troops will be based in Paris.

* It is ill judged, based on a supercilious notion of military grandeur associated with our ineffable belief that since our new found wealth we are are masters of European destiny - that our has come to show Europe that we are indeed worthy to be considered as equals .#
* We seem preoccupied in convincing Europe that we are no longer the feckless indigents of a time we seem obsessed to erase from our colective memory.

We have come a long way since our old fashioned cap-in-handedness ; so much the pity on this account.

by ronan Mon Mar 10, 2008 21:43

"The hundreds of thousands of Sudanese refugees who have fled to refugee camps just inside Chad are at the mercy of cross border attacks by Janjiweed and Sudan military forces and local rebel groups.
The Irish military mission there is to protect the refugees from attack and they will use force against the janjaweed and rebels if necessary.
The displaced people need medecine and food aid until the political and security situation is more favourable in Sudan for them to return.
Aid agencies cannot keep these people alive if the aid programs are under attack.

What would you suggest the international community should do?

Out of fear of being branded imperialists by paranoids like you they should not help the people of war torn countries?

I would like to know what you intend to do about the people of Darfur and Chad from high up in your ivory tower?"

Hi Padraig, thanks for your comments. First off, let's be clear, this is not really an Irish mission, Irish troops are participating in an EU mission with a UN mandate. The main body of the force is French, in fact, many of the French troops didn't have to travel far, since France maintains a military presence within CAR and Chad. I argue that this is not a humanitarian mission, but an imperialist intervention for the following reasons. 1) the French state which is the driving force behind this mission have a terrible humanitarian record. They back brutal dictators in CAR and Chad, were complicit in the genocide in Rwanda, and are centrally involved in the ongoing conflict in the Congo. 2) If this is the case, then why would the French state worry about a humanitarian crisis now?

I suggest an alternate explanation: Civil War in Chad and CAR threatens the French backed regimes in these countries. This regime is useful for France as a sphere of influence, a market for exports (significantly arms) and a source of resources. This alternate explanation seems to fit quite well with current EU strategic discussions about modern warfare, and the type of military strategy necessary.

Unfortunately Padraig I don't have an ivory tower, or an ivory chess-set from which I can send my ivory pawns into battle.I wrote this article because I hoped it would be read by Irish servicemen and women who might reconsider the reasons for their being sent into harm's way. I do not expect the 'international community' to take any progressive action in this situation because it itself is responsible for the endless cycle of violence that plagues Africa. The governments of this world might talk of humanitarianism, but this is just window dressing on their greater policies of accumulation that have caused such disaster.

by oiloiloil Mon Mar 10, 2008 16:42

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/kevin-myer....html even myers agrees.

More death more weapons
http://africa.reuters.com/top/news/usnBAN031108.html

by lyncher - eire Mon Mar 10, 2008 16:20

as we are all aware the french have organised this army to go to chad they put an irish man in charge as our reputation is of good standard but not for long we are being used as pons by the french so they can control the natural resources of the country just like afganastan iraq and other countrys where were they when other african countries needed them .
where is our own army to defend our own natural resources in the west of ireland that politicians have given away .
will the real irish army please stand up as this is and will be the biggest crime ever to happen to ireland 1000 billion dollors gone .

by CARpooling Mon Mar 10, 2008 13:41

"Out of fear of being branded imperialists by paranoids like you they should not help the people of war torn countries?

I would like to know what you intend to do about the people of Darfur and Chad from high up in your ivory tower?"

2 questions padraig

(1) Is intervening in a struggle like this on the side of imperialists and helping to keep their puppet corrupt government in power for even longer really helping the citizens of this country all that much in the long term?

France and her meddling caused this mess in the first place and by helping to quosh the rebels are we not just helping to prolong a bad and unstable situation. The rebels beef is with the government and who are you to say they don't have a legitimate beef with them.

(2)Is doing nothing always the worst option?? Personally I really don't think so

by Living in 2008 Mon Mar 10, 2008 10:11

The mission will be as humanitarian as the French allow it to be. First our force has to be safely inserted around the refugees but the media is a bit vague about exactly where they are now.

Essentially it is the Irish Brigade of the 1700s all over again, with Louis XV replaced by Sarkozy and his enarques.

by Padraig Mon Mar 10, 2008 09:53

The hundreds of thousands of Sudanese refugees who have fled to refugee camps just inside Chad are at the mercy of cross border attacks by Janjiweed and Sudan military forces and local rebel groups.
The Irish military mission there is to protect the refugees from attack and they will use force against the janjaweed and rebels if necessary.
The displaced people need medecine and food aid until the political and security situation is more favourable in Sudan for them to return.
Aid agencies cannot keep these people alive if the aid programs are under attack.

What would you suggest the international community should do?

Out of fear of being branded imperialists by paranoids like you they should not help the people of war torn countries?

I would like to know what you intend to do about the people of Darfur and Chad from high up in your ivory tower?

by wageslave Mon Mar 10, 2008 05:04

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/inside-f....html