Murder, Rape, Burn and Pillage

limerick | crime and justice | opinion/analysis

Tuesday September 19, 2006 19:29

by Seán Ryan

Crime in Limerick is spiralling out of control. Another man was killed in Moyross on Sunday night after being shot in the head.

McDowell reckons that the Gardaí are doing a "fantastic job."

Fat Frankie Ryan was shot in the head on Sunday night in Moyross in Limerick, a very short distance from where two young children were set on fire last week. As with other such chilling incidents, this is probably all on film. Local cctv captures most of the crime in Moyross, not like our Gardaí there, who rarely show their faces.

Whilst I’ve been writing this article another attempted murder occurred in Limerick, shots have again been fired – this time nobody was hurt – thankfully. http://www.midlandsradio.fm/news_detail.aspx?news_id=2921

Mc Dowell’s happy with the Gardaí and their inability to stop crime in Moyross. I for one (and I suspect that I’m not the only person from Moyross and from Limerick to feel this way) am not.

Crime in Limerick has been escalating since the 1970’s. It shows no sign of abating. Willie O’Dea a fellow Limerick man has gushed that there have been 16 extra Gardaí drafted into Limerick following the sickening firebomb attack that left two children from Moyross fighting for their lives. Compare this with 40 extra Gardaí being drafted into Shannon to protect the airport from the Ploughshares. And don’t mention the 600 odd personnel required to protect Bush from 6 protesters earlier this year when he stopped off in Shannon for a photo op: http://www.indymedia.ie/index.php?obj_id=53&story_id=74...40551

There was a time in Limerick (when I was a youngfella) that if you had a problem with someone, a few slaps would’ve sorted it out – with no comeback. Today, if you look at somebody wrong, your windows will be shot in that night – at best. You might be assaulted and possibly killed there and then.

No longer does the name ‘Stab City,’ seem apt. I mean it’s still pretty easy to be stabbed, but it’s just as easy to be shot or beaten to death.

There are no politicians living in the most violent areas in Limerick.

There is a desperation that pervades in many areas. The Gardaí are totally ineffective and are not trusted by local communities, despite the shite that’s been spun in the media in the last few weeks. The Gardaí spend their time catching speeding motorists and should the venture into the likes of Moyross, are to be found hassling the local kids – drug searches etc. They most certainly could not be described as ‘Guardians of the Peace’ in these areas.

Here’s a few links that expand upon the picture I’ve posted above:

McDowell 18th September 2006: ““He said gardaí in Limerick were doing a "fantastic job" in tackling local criminals and denied the Government had abandoned the city.””
http://www.breakingnews.ie/2006/09/18/story277269.html This link gives more info on the demise of Fat Frankie Ryan.

Murder:

McDowell 26th May 2003: “There are very practical reasons for the Central Criminal Court coming to sit in Limerick. There are a number of murder trials due to be heard by the Court where the accused are from Limerick. These trials will involve the calling of a considerable number of witnesses, particularly Garda witnesses. To conduct these trials in Limerick will, therefore, lead to less cost, less inconvenience for civil witnesses and, most important of all, result in Gardai having to spend a much lesser amount of time away from their normal policing duties.
Needless to say, I am concerned at the recent serious criminal activities in Limerick...” http://www.justice.ie/80256E01003A02CF/vWeb/pcJUSQ5XNBTL-en

McDowell 28th February 2004: “…The reason I have done this is that I believe there has been a perceptible but consistent diminution in the perceived value of human life in our society and, in particular, in the context of the intentional crime of murder. Finding, as I did, that some participants in recent Limerick clan feuding had served less than 7 years for a premeditated murder, I believe that the message must now go out to anyone who uses intentional violence as part of their lifestyle that if such intentional violence results in a murder conviction that they will stay in jail for a very, very long time indeed. Having said that my own personal conviction is that there are only very few people for whom the prospect of rehabilitation should not be held out as a realistic, if remote, possibility. It's very important that public support for and confidence in the criminal justice system should be rebuilt and strengthened.” http://www.justice.ie/80256E01003A02CF/vWeb/pcJUSQ5XUD5V-en

Willie O’Dea 19th November 2003: “Last night, the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform outlined the murder statistics in this State. He pointed out that most murders since 1997 are not, in so far as can be determined, gangland related. However, the statistics relating to the city I represent are somewhat different. There have been 40 murders in Limerick since 1997, most of them gang-related. The chief superintendent of the Limerick Garda division has supplied figures relating to these murders.” http://www.irlgov.ie/debates-03/19Nov/Sect6.htm

Rape:

http://breaking.tcm.ie/2005/09/13/story220590.html

http://www2.limerickpost.ie/dailynews.elive?id=6059&cat...y-Fri (One should remember when reading this article that less than 50 cases of rape were tried in our courts last year, in the whole country!)

http://www.villagemagazine.ie/article.asp?sid=1&sud=10&...=1514

http://www.progressivedemocrats.ie/press_room/1862/ Former Party Leader Mary Harney says she shares the outrage which followed the release of a man jailed for the statutory rape of a 12-year-old girl.

Burn:

Struggle to survive in this wasteland that the people of Moyross call home http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=...14655

http://www.limerickpost.ie/dailynews.elive?id=7640&cate...y-Thu

Jim Kemmy 11th March 1992: “Moyross is the largest housing estate in Limerick and is situated on the north side of the city. There are more than 1,200 houses in the estate. There are 294 houses in the Glenagross Park section of which 70 are boarded up… Some have been burned out and it is like a sight from Beirut…” http://www.oireachtas-debates.gov.ie/D/0417/D.0417.1992....html

http://www2.limerickpost.ie/fullnews.elive?id=50&catego...=news

Pillage:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2004/0309/Limerick.html

http://www.clarechampion.ie/clch/www/index.asp?magpage=...d=491

http://www.rte.ie/news/2003/1030/limerick.html

http://www.checkout.ie/News.asp?ID=364

More bits and pieces: Where Gardai fear to thread.. http://indymedia.ie/article/78444 There are more links at the bottom of my comment in this piece that lead to some more of my musings on this subject.

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Comments (20 of 20)

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Just in

Tue Sep 19, 2006 21:16

Garda Bill ‘will not lead to effective community policing’
http://www.eveningecho.ie/news/bstory.asp?j=172821446&p...22134

Does it bother you that the present Tanaiste has been singularly ineffective?

by anon

Tue Sep 19, 2006 23:11

In matters pertaining to the *prisons*, the *Laffoy Judgement*, the* policing problem*
but is perceived as effective in relation to Immigration control, Privacy/Defamation laws
(The alliance of independent Press councils of Europe insisted that giving a press council
statutory recognition was far from the norm)http://www.ireland.com

not to mention his lobbying on leadership of the PD's and the Critical Infrastructure Board.

That the drafting of legislations by his office has given ineffective support to victims of crime and their families but effectively curtailed individual rights and liberties?

Compassion and care

Wed Sep 20, 2006 21:01

The 18 year old kid that was in the car with Fat Frankie Ryan, when he was shot in the head last Sunday night, has been released from custody. He was held and questioned for two days by the Gardaí despite being deeply traumatised.

Two days...

In deep shock...

A kid...

http://www.limerickpost.ie/dailynews.elive?id=7654&cate...y-Wed

This is some releationship that the Gardaí have with the people of Moyross. Remember McDowell described their work as 'fantastic.'

Here's another example of the relationship that the Justice system has in general with the people of Limerick: http://indymedia.ie/article/77642

army

by pete

Fri Sep 22, 2006 00:54

What are the army doing.
I think they should be brought out into the streets of limerick to help instill peace in the city.
By the look of things they are required here moreso than peace keeping abroad.

Cop on.

by Angry

Fri Sep 22, 2006 02:29

What would you have the army do? It is up to the civil powers (ie: the Gardai and the Irish justice service to fix this problem not the Military)
What would you have the army do?
You should develop a sense of cop on before you make comments like this. The Defence Forces cannot operate without the authority of the civil power.

Angry

by pat c

Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:18

I reckon hes not serious. Its just a line thrown out - send in the army! What are they supposed to do? Retake Moyross, street by street? What is required is proper investment in community facilities, education, childcare, training.

There are also anti-social elements which will have to be driven out of the area. But where do you send them? Not an easy question to answer.

Lip-Service

Fri Sep 22, 2006 13:59

I think the media are responsible for letting the government and the Justice System off the hook here. They make the issues look very copmplex and difficult to solve. Whereas the real issue lies in the fact that the authorities have done nothing whatsoever to solve the problems in Moyross and other areas, other than to pay lip-service to them.

As I've said already, here and elsewhere on Indy; not a lot happens in Moyross that isn't on camera. The cameras are a community initiative and project, the Gardaí normally pick up video footage to use for their evidence (they rarely gather any other evidence, other than their 'interviews' with people, that they do, subsequent to getting the video evidence).

There are three entrances and exits to and from Moyross (by road). If a Garda manned the video room in the Moyross community centre and directed Gardaí, virtually no crime in Moyross could go undetected. This would not require much in terms of manpower, and would require little or no investment in equipment - it's already there.

This is not brain surgery.

Also, why not take the following approach to policing: When planning to build a new Garda Station, why not build it where crime levels are high. This would cut down on response time, it cuts the ammount of petrol used (I'm not being a smart arse here, Gardaí use lots of petrol) and it acts as a deterrent (if it doesn't act as a deterrent then the whole idea of policing in Ireland needs to be re-thought). Let's make the system efficient, both in its operation and in its results.

And let's give the people of Limerick peace of mind and freedom.

efficiency....

by a cop lover

Fri Sep 22, 2006 14:05

Let's make the system efficient, both in its operation and in its results.

you are in Ireland here, get a grip, nothing is efficient here, nd if the cops clamped down real real hard and arrested the main individuals the cops would then be overefficient and have higher targets next year and they could not have that going on, its all about status quo round here im afraid, poor boys just wanna get paid

mmmmmmmmmm

by Conspiracy theorist - #

Fri Sep 22, 2006 14:09

Well the Tanaiste could let it really run down, a few more killings, maimings
and then loads of lovely abso's . more erosion of rights. more curtailing
of liberties.

Hey it's Thatcherism- it suits the powers that be to have people ghettoised
lacking essential supports. sounds like some door-stepping of mr Mc Dowell's
running mates are in order.

cops will have guns next- would you give Robocop a gun?

Round and round she goes, where she'll stop nobody knows

Mon Sep 25, 2006 10:17

A young boy and an older woman were shot last night in Moyross. Gardai are 'investigating.' Thankfully neither was killed.

This incident is being hailed as the latest incident in the long running feud.

What a load of bollocks!

By the way, Robocop was promoted to detective and probably was given a gun.

The boy injured last night is 15. I wonder is he an early school leaver?

Newspapers and other forms of propaganda always avoid giving the readers news. I've been reading now for a number of weeks, how much the people of Moyross have been given, eg. a 'great' primary school etc. I wonder what percentage of young people in Moyross are early school leavers?

What is the average reading level?

What is the average income?

What is the average value of debt?

So many questions, so little information - just waffle.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breaking/story.asp?j=16132...89&x=

Sean Ryan

by curious

Mon Sep 25, 2006 11:02

I am confused. Do you beleive that the people shot were shot because of their educational attainments? Or alternatively that those who shot them did so because of their unhappiness at the education which they themselves received?

Pat C

Mon Sep 25, 2006 11:06

You ask where anti-social elements ought to be driven. Prison surely. And yes, yes, people will repsond that prison does not solve anything. Well, actually it does. At least for so long as the scum in question are locked up and that should be a long time. Then if they reoffend. Guess what? Lock them up again. The less criminals on the streest, the less crime.

Trouble is

by A10

Mon Sep 25, 2006 12:22

that locking them up costs money.Quite alot of it here in Ireland actually.what with profit making builders on Govt contracts,prision warders on triple overtime,etc etc.Not to mind doddery old judges who never enforce the full sentenceing,because where is there to put alll the criminals,as there isnt enough jail spaces???Visious circles and all that.

A10

by Curious

Mon Sep 25, 2006 12:26

Money well spent surely? One of problems is that many of those who develop into really bad cases have expereienced years of leniency prior to ever losing a day of freedom. It is not unusual for serial muggers/car theives/burglars etc to have run up dozens of convictions prior to being 'sent down'. Interestingly, there is a strong argument that similar leniancy in the US in the 1960s led to the explosion of crime in the late 60's/70s that led to the imposition of much severer penalties.

The point

Mon Sep 25, 2006 18:23

The fact of the matter is that more than half of all those in prison in this country are serving sentences of 12 months or less. More than half of these people are doing sentences of 3 months.

Methinks I see the problem. Methinks I've been bitching and ranting about it on Indymedia.ie for around six months at this stage.

There are no prison spaces for serious crimes because we fill our prisons with folks doing time for not so serious offences. There is a prioritisation system in place, agreed, but its polarity is reversed. Read my article on it: Murder is more than an image thing http://indymedia.ie/article/75087

As for the comments about education: My point was to do with political and media driven misdirection. It is spun that money is being spent and that services are being provided. This is utter and contemptible claptrap. The people of Moyross and in other spots in Limerick, and for that matter, all around the country, have nothing, only fear.

The few bad apples that are often rolled out as excuses, are mislabeled, and in reality are those who lead our country. They are the ones who are anti-social. What is needed in Moyross and other places, is society.

Better alternative but totally unplatable

Mon Sep 25, 2006 21:35

Do what the Met did in the 50s with the East End Gangs of the Kray bros ,etc.Dedicate police squad with the right and power to pull in any expert in LEO or civillian as needed to sit 24/7/365 We never close on each family and main player,so that they cant fart or shit witout the squad knowing it.Also give them the right to search and tap phone ,email etc.Midnite ,dawn ,dusk raids etc for arms or drugs.Get CAB to investigate how people on the dole can afford 4kplus Rolexes or drive around in 20k customised boy racer cars.This will cause them to stress and hopefully make a major mistake in their drug dealing.Plus flood the area with cops so that there is one onalmost every street corner.Because that is really what it is all about in the end.Nothing Else.
Trouble is this will require somthing all Irish politicans are missing BALLS and SPINE to get a grip on this

Water cannon needed to tackle ‘rampaging youths’

by Shotgun

Fri Sep 29, 2006 12:01

Stab City

Water cannon needed to tackle ‘rampaging youths’

FOLLOWING the jailing of a Limerick man yesterday after a mob attacked the emergency services on a late night call, the Limerick State Solicitor Michael Murray called for the deployment of water cannon in the city to tackle street violence.

Mc Dowell

by chris murray

Fri Sep 29, 2006 16:14

Has recruited 6,000 new garda reserves. He announced this after upholding the right of the
Irish people not to have a Taoiseach who took bribes (allegedly), , Mahon, meanwhile,
is investigating why Geraldine Kennedy (who may face two years in Mountjoy women's
prison) burnt the evidence, regarding the monies handed to Ahern- she is claiming
journalistic privilege on her source. and Michael (as Tanaiste) becomes Taoiseach in the
event of Government collapse- but we all know that will not happen.

so its a general election (which makes Michael the shortest serving Tanaiste
in the history of the Irish state) or a severely weakened (!) FF with Mc Dowell
holding the reins-but sure it will be grand, he's got 6,000 extra cops on the streets.

give people a chance

by ex moyross tenent

Sat Jun 23, 2007 12:24

There are some decent people living in the moyross area for over 20 years that have brought up good families, the reason moyross has gone down hill is because the local councill are giving houses to children that are having children,you dont give a 17 year old a 3 bedroom house and expect her not to use it as a party house, she is a young mother that will prob not get out to socialise so she will do it all at home. There is the cause of ur troubles house parties leed to drugs drink and arguments between teenagers.
I have seen the guards pull over and hassle children as young as 10 when they are playing in the field but then in another section of the field there will be a group of teenagers getting off their faces on drugs and they will be ignored by thr guarda.
Not all of moyross is bad there are people with a good education and good jobs that have come out of moyross.

all the same

by Estates

Sat Jun 23, 2007 12:46

I agree totally with you XMoyross resident. There are good bad not just in all estates but in the country also. That's a fact. There is a young mother who had to get out of her home and live in rented accommod. because of neighboursm and relations. Because she is a single parent it doe's not suit living in the country. (they are very religious) Living in Moyross would be a hell of a lot safer than living in the country. Look at all the old people who are attacked. So the residents of Moyross be proud of yourselves. Look around towns and see the amount of mentally ill walking about, look athe the amount of young people pulled out of rivers. (those are anot ll fromMoyross)
Ifn the election it was amazing how All the Elderly came out and voted..., and the result is the present government. If everyone in Estates voted there might be a different outcome, if they vote against this EU Blair and let those politicians know who really is boss,there might be a very happy outcome and money ploughed back into our homes for heating and food.and education..Do you agree?

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Murder, Rape, Burn and Pillage

Comments (20 of 20)