Abortion Rights Campaign established in Dublin today.

by Jane Wed Jan 30, 2013 18:08

Well done stereotyping those who dont choose to avail of abortion as people from incestuous families,you go on to say how does that help build a better society.?Such BS you come out with.How can you make the assumption all those who dont avail of abortion are part of some incestuous relationship??

You see you have shown your frustration for having an open argument with me on abortion,by throwing around accusations,first you accuse me of promoting church dogma,and then being part of some religion.
Sorry to dissapoint im not part of some religion and im not pushing church dogma,you then ask me why dont i protest???????
What has protesting at shannon airport got to do with this argument exactly???

You just dont get it.Do you?

My question is how does abortion build a better society.With abortion on demand,it will produce a generation lost,a society is nothing without a future,and a future is nothing without a growing generation.

Something abortion on demand would wipe out.

Like i said before ireland is a small nation,with a small population,the reason government wont fully legislate is all to do with population,cause and effect..Something YOU should think about.
Instead of coming from your own personal point of view.

Pushing YOUR own abortion dogma.

by fred Wed Jan 30, 2013 13:36

Ok, lets assume your argument is genuine.

people are still having the abortions. The population is still going down.

It's just going down via England. This changes nothing.

Except of course that it imposes more hardship on poorer girls.

They'll still do it though.

So how exactly have you helped the population?

Also, it's approx 4,000 per year. And many have solid reasons for not having the baby.

Emigration was more than that number per WEEK!

And why NOT limit condoms and contraception, if your concern is purely to increase population then that has a certain logic. Yet you totally pooh pooh this.

You should be out promoting free love, attacking current neo-liberal FG economic policies or banning tobacco use, not campaigning against abortion! It would be more effective use of your time.

The fact is Jane, you don't really care about the population do you?. Otherwise you'd be far more concerned with emigration than abortion and taking more targetted measures than fighting abortion legislation that affects a small number of medical cases. It makes no sense to focus on this if your concern is increasing population. I deduce either you're irrational and just haven't thought it through, or you're just rationalising a particular misogynistic stance on abortion for some other reason. Religiosity seems most likely reason for this.

Of course having an abortion is not exactly fun. What did your friend expect? It should only be a last resort having thought through the options. Education, self control and proper use of contraception are always the preferred option. Abortion if introduced should be backed up with a solid campaign of sex education.

But a womans body is her own. Women should have the last word on it and be free to take that option if after deliberation that's what they decide to do.

They still don't have to avail of it. But it's there if they need it.

And we might as well have the extra jobs here instead of England if nothing else!

And Jane, tell me, would you expect a woman to have the child of her rapist or abusive incestuous father?? It happens. And probably far more often than our fake little "caring" society might have us believe.

and far more often than cases like Savita H.

How would a whole heap of families like that help us build a better society. I mean, what a start in life that is for a kid and it's mum. It's more than just numbers y'know!

Or for that matter a whole heap more poor stressed out single mothers.

Unless of course you just want a pool of lots of poor miserable people to wok for very low wages in your factories / businesses?

by Jane Wed Jan 30, 2013 12:39

Youre making assumptions kid.

Im not pushing the church dogma. In fact im an atheist,i dont believe in a higher power.You got it wrong there kid.

And yes i do give a shit about life once it comes outside the womb,dont proport to know what im about.

I never said anything about banning condoms,if people want to take precautions they should do,but ABORTION,shouldn't be one of them.

And its not a scratch out all mistake solution.It doesnt work like that.

I went with a friend took the flights and everything with her for her to get an abortion. Its not a painless procedure,and it doesnt come without complications either.

She got no aftercare afterwards,just one shitty counselling session she had to pay for,she is still depressed about it and its 2 years later.

Lastly Ireland does not have the population mass to sustain abortion on demand,were an ageing population,where the death rate EXCEEDS the birth rate.

The government dont want to legislate it for everyone because it will mean less growing populations in Ireland.

You have to think of these things in regard of cause and effect.Not just push it from a personal point of view without knowing the knock on effects!

You see you call me the nut job pushing the church but is really YOU who isa nut job pushing the abortion agenda,no matter what the circumstance..

by fred Mon Jan 28, 2013 21:15

should we ban condoms as well Jane? I mean they are preventing births too?

And I suppose Emigration is not reducing the population at all?

What about all that increased economic recruitment into the british army?

Don't see you moaning about any of that. Just the abortions. Funny that Jane.

You are a typical pro life nutjob plain and simple. Totally focussed on life while it's in a woman's womb, but don't give a shit about life once it comes out.

"Pro life" doesn't just mean "pro foetal life only". You should also be protesting the use of our airports in war. Or the deaths caused by austerity cuts in our hospitals. Why aren't you? Because you are a liar and a hypocrite pushing church dogma, just like all pro lifers.

by Jane Mon Jan 28, 2013 13:57

I find it very decieful how you twist this into a class debate.You see Ireland doesn't have the poplulation to sustain abortion on demand.
What you will have is an ageing population and lots of abortions, eg. no births.

What sustains a population is a healthy birth rate,thats the unpalatable truth,so you can whinge and whine about the classes all you like..

It doesnt change those facts i just outlined.

by fred Sun Jan 27, 2013 06:48

"Im not a pro abortion person,or an anti abortion person for that matter,"

then you launch into a typical anti "abortion on demand" tirade....

Yeah right!

Let those poor girls from tallaght keep having to have unwanted babies who will have lives of poverty drugs and misery costing the state a packet to deal with, and destroying their mother's already limited future prospects, while the posh girls from southside have a nice weekend in England, go on to college, travel the world, get a cool job.. Nice.

You do realise 4000+ girls will still have "abortion on demand". All you have done is move the place they do it.

You are effectively just taxing poorer women.

by Jane Sat Jan 26, 2013 18:56

Im not a pro abortion person,or an anti abortion person for that matter,i think it depends on the situation really to be honest.If it is a case of incest etc,well then so be it,if the woman wants to avail of it..
What i am wholly against is abortion on demand,i think it would destroy this country,and Ireland, i believe is not ready for abortion.
The UK has a huge population,a few million abortions in that blood business even,wouldnt put a dent in the country,but in Ireland,it would have huge knock on effects.We are a small population,and purely speaking from that point of view,it could make our populations even smaller.
Aside from that,there are untold traumas of abortion,its not an easy pain free procedure,theres no aftercare,and does come with emotional baggage,it doesnt come without regret.
If abortion is legalised in Ireland im sure there will be some patients whose reasons for their abortion,are more flippant than ever,such as not being pregnant 'at the right time' etc..
Flippant reasoning like this could ruin this small country.Were already an ageing population as it is,and abortion wont help with that whatsoever,it will only excaberate the situation,and make it a thousand times worse.Were only as good as the future generations of this country.If we dont allow the future generations to grow - we simply have no future.

by fred Tue Jan 22, 2013 20:31

Brian

I'm presuming you are referring to how the state systematically takes away benefits from poor mothers and children, despite pretending to be pro life?

I think it's disgusting that the bishops that covered up child rape get a private audience with our taoiseach to push their medievil misogynist views on this matter wheras the pro choice groups (who didn't cover up any child rapes) don't.

what a fucked up hypocritical little country we live in.

by BrianClarke - AllVoices Mon Jan 21, 2013 17:22

Every Sperm is Sacred in ireland. Abortion is murder and condoms are kinda like kidnapping !

Abortion

Caption: Video Id: fUspLVStPbk Type: Youtube Video
Every Sperm is Sacred